I never felt guilty about being a rock star. You become a star because of what you do. In thrash metal, we are music of the people, by the people, for the people.”
Wikimetal: Hello, Dave.
Dave Ellefson: Hi, how are you?
W: Hi Dave, it's a real honor and pleasure to be talking to you, how are you?
FROM: Thank you, I'm very well, thank you.
W: To start things off, Dave, what would you consider to be the biggest influences that made you choose to be a bass player? And who are your favorite bass players?
DE: Well, I grew up… I basically only listened to music on the radio, because I grew up in a very rural part of the United States, a Midwestern state called Minnesota, and it's all farms there, so what I heard on the radio was basically: Sweet, Kiss, Aerosmith, that kind of thing, so a lot of American and British hard rock. And then, of course, Kiss was very important in making me want to play. And the bass was a very intriguing instrument, I had never heard anything like it before, and then when I saw it, it was big and long and had strings, and I liked the people who played it, like Gene Simmons, and that was inspiring to me. And then when I started playing, I obviously started listening to bands like Rush and Iron Maiden, and then it was my turn, when we started Megadeth.
W: Dave, in Dave Mustaine's book, "A Life in Metal," he tells a really cool story about when you two met. Could you please tell our listeners what happened, how you met Dave Mustaine?
DE: Well, five days after I graduated high school in 1983, I was 18 years old, and me and three friends drove from Minnesota to Hollywood, California. And the apartment we moved into, Dave was living right above it, and I didn't know Dave, actually I'd never heard of Metallica before, because being from the Midwest, music and entertainment news was very slow. And the East and West coasts and parts of Europe were starting to get to this new wave of heavy metal that was being called thrash metal. I hadn't heard of that yet. So meeting Dave… One morning I woke up and was practicing, I think it was “Running with the Devil,” or something like that, by Van Halen, and I heard this high-pitched scream telling me to shut up, and right after that I heard something hit my air conditioner, and my first thought was, “Well, people in California aren't as friendly as in Minnesota.” My friend had seen Dave walking around the condo complex, and he said, “We should meet this guy, he seems like a cool rock 'n' roll guy,” so we went to knock on his door. First, we wanted to buy some cigarettes, and he looked at us and slammed the door in our faces. Then we knocked again to buy beer, and he opened the door for us. So that was basically our first encounter with Dave. We were drinking beer and telling stories, and we met him and heard the story about Metallica and his departure from the band. And he started playing some of the songs he had written post-Metallica, which would become “Set the World on Fire,” “Devil's Island,” and a few others. And we all loved them; we thought they were incredible songs, and we also saw some of Dave's lyrics. He had a very simple, but also very ingenious method of telling stories in his lyrics. So that inspired me, and the other thing about Dave that you have to realize is that he was doing something completely new, you know, you have to understand that this was in 1983, so everything that was happening in Los Angeles was what would be considered pop metal, hair metal, that kind of thing… Mötley Crëw had already started to become successful, Ratt was becoming famous, WASP, many of these bands, these were the main bands in Hollywood, and all the Brooklyn music was starting to take off at that time.
W: Changing the subject now, Dave, speaking of your new album “Thirteen”, what caught my attention was the large number of good songs on this album. Any particular reason for that, for example, the fact that you came back to the band?
DE: I think… I don't think albums are a one-person thing. Albums are a collection of songs, and all creative work is a collaboration on many levels. There's collaboration within the band, musically. I think bringing Johnny K. on as the producer for the album brought a new dynamic to the band and a very productive mode of production as well, you know, we didn't have much time to make the album, and often in Megadeth, when we don't have much time, sometimes that's when we produce our best material, too.
W: Yeah, I was going to ask about Johnny K., how did you choose him to be the producer of “Thirteen”, and what was it like working with him?
DE: I've been a fan of Johnny's work ever since I heard the Disturbed albums. I think, you know, the work he did, he did a lot of things in Chicago for many years, he was already friends with Dan Donegan from Disturbed, and when they signed with Warner Brothers, Dan insisted that Johnny produce the album, and that's what put Johnny on the map as a great music producer. And I think the work he did with that band was phenomenal. So, when I heard more of their stuff, or realized that Johnny isn't one of those producers who makes the band sound like him, he seems like a producer who came in and really discovered the essence of the band and made it better. And that, to me, is something I thought would be very important with Megadeth, because we'd already had experiences in the '90s with producers who tried to mold us into something that wasn't Megadeth, and we never want anything like that again. So Johnny, Dave and I got along well, and it seemed like the songs flowed, and before we knew it we had made an album.
W: Dave, we have a classic question on our show, one that we ask everyone we interview: imagine you're driving your car listening to your iPod on shuffle, and then a song comes on that makes you completely lose control, you start headbanging wherever you are. Can you choose that song so we can play it on our show right now?
DE: Sure, I'd say there are two. Probably the main one would be – I heard it yesterday – Black Sabbath's "Neon Knights".
W: Dave, I think "Thirteen" is a very good album, in my opinion, the best Megadeth album since "Countdown to Extinction," maybe. What's your favorite Megadeth album?
DE: You know, it's funny you say that, because I think my all-time favorite album is "Countdown to Extinction." Actually, I was listening to it yesterday with my son. My son is 15, and he was listening to some Megadeth albums. And this is kind of a new journey for him, discovering these albums, and the first thing that caught his attention is how timeless the album is, it doesn't sound like a dated album that was made 20 years ago, it still sounds new. And I was listening… For me, there's no other band that has this sound. So these are very fundamental components for any great album, they can't sound dated and they can't sound like anything that already exists.
W: You're absolutely right, and I completely agree with you. For example, last year we had the release of the 25th-anniversary edition of "Peace Sells... But Who's Buying?". What do you remember about the recording of that album that made it so special, relevant, and unique? As you said, Megadeth has such a unique sound, and especially "Peace Sells..." is so relevant after all this time?
DE: Yeah, I'd say that "Peace Sells..." is another one of those albums that's certainly unique and definitely didn't sound like our contemporaries, you know, at the time, obviously the Big Four, as we're called now, we were making our most pioneering albums back then, and I think Megadeth, we definitely had a different sound from all of them. And I think that was mostly because Dave and I were the metal guys, and Gar and Chris were the fusion jazz guys, and the hybrid of those two genres really created a musical ferocity on the albums that was unmatched by any other band at the time. And I also think the tuning of that album, as strange as it may sound, you know, we tuned that album to G, but that added a very dark and mystical mood to the whole album, and I think that's something that… I know because I'm a musician and I play a lot, but people say "wow, your songs are so dark". And I think that regarding the lyrics, there's a dark intrigue, which I believe was created by the tuning of the instruments, resulting in that unique sound.
And it was the first time in many years that I walked into a room with a band and felt genuinely inspired to write songs; I felt like a teenager again.”
W: I've seen you guys play in Brazil many times. I went to Rock in Rio in '91, "Monsters of Rock" with Ozzy and Alice Cooper in '95, and last year at the SWU Festival with Faith No More and Alice in Chains. Do you have any particular memories of Brazil that you could share with our listeners?
FROM: Oh, wow, you know, last year's festival was fantastic, I mean, Brazil is known for its monumental festivals, and I think that starting with Rock in Rio was definitely a great experience, being part of Rock in Rio in 1991 was such a big thing at the time, and I think every time I go back there, you know, I played at the "Monsters of Rock" festival and at SWU, it's always, you know… It's the scale of it, it shows the size of the support that the Brazilian people give to heavy metal.
W: Speaking of the old days, Dave, how would you compare the music scene in the '80s to now? What are the good and bad things about both periods?
FROM: I think the '80s were the great moment of rock 'n' roll, its glory days. It was something that united people, united so many people around the world. It was something that… It was a contribution, you know, the girls dressed up and looked beautiful, and the men dressed up to get the girls… It was a form of entertainment at the time, and I think that as soon as the '90s and the Seattle Grunge movement came along, and all this anti-rock star thing… Everyone apologizing for being a rock star, I never understood that. I never felt guilty for being a rock star. You become a star because of what you do, you know, if you just want to succeed out of narcissism, you should probably feel guilty about that. For us, I think, in thrash metal, we are music of the people, by the people, for the people.
W: What is the importance of the Big Four reunion? How important do you think this reunion was for heavy metal in general, and also for the creation of a new generation of metal fans?
DE: I think, first of all, it wasn't really a reunion, because the four of us had never played together before. You're right in the sense that it was a reunion where we had all played together before, just not on the same stage. And I think that unity probably generated renewed interest and put thrash metal forever on the front page of heavy metal history.
W: And, I think, in the history of rock as well.
DE: Yes, absolutely. Exactly, I think that took thrash metal from being kind of a bastard child in the corner and solidified and validated it in the history of rock N' roll.
W: Do you remember the first time you heard about this project, or when you were invited to participate in it?
DE: Yes, I heard about it… Actually, it was before I came back to Megadeth. I was touring with Tim “Ripper” Owens in Europe, we were at the Download Festival in England, and the agent came to me – who was a longtime friend – he came to me and mentioned this idea, and I thought, “Wow, that’s fantastic!” So we started discussing my return to Megadeth and it seemed like everything was going well. My agent told me, “Go for it.” And I’m very glad I did, because this story really had a Cinderella ending.
W: Could you choose a Megadeth song that you're very proud to have been a part of, or that you wrote or recorded, for us to listen to on the show now?
DE: Sure. I would say "Foreclosure of a Dream," because it's the story of what happened to my father and many of his friends, who suffered from the governmental problems here in the United States at the end of the 80s, during the Reaganomics, and that caused a major crisis.
Gene Simmons was an inspiration to me. And then when I started playing, I obviously started listening to bands like Rush and Iron Maiden.”
W: Speaking of your projects and experiences outside of Megadeth, such as F5, Hail, Killing Machine, Temple of Brutality, and you also played with Soulfly. Do you think it's possible to describe what all these projects had in common, musically?
DE: Well, I think they were all heavy rock projects. What I think I liked most about them is that they were all very different from each other. Soulfly… F5 was probably the first thing I worked on post-Megadeth, because at that time Megadeth was distracting me. And that was so new, and it was fun playing with younger guys who had a certain appreciation and even a little bit of Megadeth influence and understood music in a completely different way, different tunings, and also had different influences, so it was very liberating and invigorating for me, and it was the first time in many years that I walked into a room with a band and felt genuinely inspired to write songs, I felt like a teenager again. Then, obviously, when I got the call to play on the Soulfly album, it was something similar, because Max, of course, had already defined what Soulfly's music was, but when I came to play bass, Max… It was a reinvention of Soulfly at that moment, so I'm proud to have been a part of that process. And also, you know, Max just looked at me and said, “Dude, go out there and play whatever you want,” so that whole part of my life was very liberating, and Terms of Brutality was the same thing, it took me in the middle of my years of experience as a heavy metal bassist and led me into a completely new process that was just beginning, and to be one of the elements that brought it all together and turned it into a real band.
W: Well, we loved your participation in that project, and we love Max, as you can imagine, being Brazilians, we interviewed him a few weeks ago, he's a true legend to us. Changing the subject, Dave, how has Christianity changed your life, and what would you say to someone facing the same drug and alcohol problems you faced in the past? Do you think religion can help people in that kind of situation?
FROM: What I think is this: I think we are all born with an inherent desire to know our creator. It's like when you're born, you want to know your parents – I see this with people who are my friends now, who were adopted when we were little, they have this desire to know their real father and mother. And I think that's something that's imprinted on us, wanting to know – we call it God – but it's our creator. And I think that during our lives, the evil that exists in the world can be very blinding, and its mission is to distract us from knowing God. And when we stray from knowing God and where we came from, you know, our creator, that's when problems appear in our lives, you know, and it's easy to fall into that, if you start using drugs and gambling, all those things that can be harmful and can end up killing us. So I think that when we… I think the great key to overcoming these things is admitting defeat. And that's good, because what isn't meant for us, kills us. So, admitting that these things kill us, there's strength in that. I gained that strength from my weakness, and I think that at this moment we can come back. But I need to disconnect and return to this life; they call it being born again. It's like a rebirth; we have the chance to have two lives within our own life, and we can start over. And that's a cool thing, and sometimes it happens through religion itself, sometimes it happens through a more personal connection with the search for God. I think it's a more personal thing, and sometimes religion, even though it has helped many people, I think everyone has to discover for themselves what liberates them and what represses them.
W: Those are wise words, Dave. We're wrapping up the interview – first of all, I'd like to thank you immensely; we've been fans of your band and your work for, say, 27, 28 years, since Megadeth's first album. So it's a great honor to be able to speak with you. Just to conclude the interview, what would you say to a 14 or 15-year-old boy who is thinking about learning to play an instrument and forming a band? And please leave a final message for all your Brazilian fans.
FROM: I think everyone who starts learning an instrument soon discovers what inspires them, and I would say: go after those passions, whatever that musical style may be. I think it's great, as a musician, to be able to play with as many different people as possible, whether it's in a jam session at your house, or forming a band in the garage, or, if you have ambitions for stardom, whatever it is, I think, you know, music is something that unites people, don't focus so much on the result, just enjoy the process.
W: Excellent, Dave. Thank you again, it was an honor and we will always support Megadeth in whatever you guys want to do, and you can count on Wikimetal, we'll always be there.
FROM: Great. Thank you very much, it was very nice talking to you. Bye!
