In November, the multi-platinum Canadian band and four-time JUNO Awards winner, The Sheepdogs , released the EP Hell Together . The project is a companion piece to their previous EP, Paradise Alone , and the band's second release from their own label.
In an interview with Wikimetal , Ewan Currie (vocals) and Ryan Gullen (bass) talk about the band's 20 years, the new phase in their career, and their most recent EPs.
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Wikimetal: Congratulations on the new EP, Hell Together . How does it connect with the previous EP, Paradise Alone ?
Ewan Currie: Thematically, it's like two sides of the same coin. It's like Paradise Alone is about being in a beautiful, amazing place, but alone, and Hell Together is about being in a terrible situation or being in hell, but having good company. They're like two different sides thematically, but I think musically they flow perfectly together. It's rock 'n' roll and I think it's us digging deeper towards our roots.
WM: You experimented more with the style of American music on this album. I'd like to know what that process was like, writing the two albums almost one after the other?
EC: I think as we get older, maybe I'm more interested in the beautiful simplicity of American music. I think when you're young you want every riff to be the biggest and best à la Led Zeppelin , and you want [your music] to be an aggressive, insane banger to people's heads. And I think as I get older, I'm more drawn to a great melody, good harmonies, a really good chorus. But there's also a simplicity in roots rock 'n' roll that's like that movie, Ratatouille , where he thinks about how good his mother's Ratatouille is compared to sophisticated cuisine. I think that's something I know I crave more as we progress in this career.
Ryan Gullen: Another thing worth mentioning is that we really try not to make the same record repeatedly. This isn't the first time we've explored this, but I think we all really appreciate a simple, straightforward kind of rock, but also something that's maybe a little more colorful or flavorful, like in other things we've done before. One of the things we try to do when recording an album is not to record the same songs repeatedly. And to explore, to venture into that kind of realm where rock 'n' roll meets roots and blues music and, in a way, creates a mix of those things with some country elements and things like that, is something we really enjoy. We like other artists doing that. But for us, we don't just listen to one specific type of music or one specific artist. We try to draw our inspiration from different places and kind of fuse it all together. So the process is quite fun because you're really challenging yourself to add elements that maybe stray a little bit from pure rock 'n' roll.
WM: Are there any artists who inspire you and who people might be surprised to know about?
EC: That's a good question. You know what's funny? When we were working on these songs, we were kind of on a wave of listening to 80s and 90s country music. I don't know what people's relationship with country music is like in Brazil, but where we come from, in Saskatchewan, that's the kind of music you'd hear at a wedding or a prom or parties when you're growing up. So we were listening to "Cadillac Ranch" by the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band , or, for example, Alan Jackson . And what impressed me most about these bands is that this kind of music doesn't sound exactly like them, but what I really respect about this music is that it's really danceable. It's just guitar music with guys singing and all that, but if you put that in a party, people will dance. And I think that's something quite absent in rock 'n' roll, especially nowadays. You don't see people dancing that much.
So I was really happy when we started playing these songs live and we started seeing people dancing in the audience. For example, “Darlin’ Baby,” which is one of our new songs. We see couples dancing together, in a romantic way, but people also enjoy some of the new tracks. Our guitarist, Ricky, likes to reference a quote from Keith Richards where he says that a lot of rock music has forgotten to “roll.” As if the roll of rock 'n' roll is missing. It's like everyone just wants to put their fists in the air and all that. But I think the roll has been lost, and that should be the part where people who are in love try to get along and have fun.
WM: This is your second release under your own label. What has changed for you now that you're no longer tied to a major record company?
RG: I think the biggest thing for us is the freedom to do things a little differently. When you're on a record label, it's not that they aren't passionate about what they do or don't want to do good things for your music, but we always had in mind that nobody would care as much as we do. We also want to try to be different and not just follow the status quo. And I think part of that is that we want to move away a little from the traditional model of releasing an album every two years. We wanted to try to increase the frequency with which we release music.
We want to try experimenting with different types of projects and different things. And it's not that the record label wouldn't necessarily be open to it, but we kind of decided that we'd rather try doing it ourselves, in our own way, and surround ourselves with people who help us create our own kind of environment instead of just being put in one place. And that allows us, for example, to explore some other genres without someone from the label telling us that a certain song doesn't have the potential to be a single. We have a lot of confidence in what we do and we really know who we are.
I also think that when we think long-term about our lives, we prefer to take the money we earn making music and reinvest it in ourselves to make more music, rather than spending a large portion of that money on buying a new car or a house for someone who owns or runs a record label. We like to pay the people around us who support us. It's not just us who do this. We have great people we employ who help us, but we prefer to surround ourselves with like-minded people and allow ourselves to advance our careers by reinvesting the money we earn in music rather than in the infrastructure of a record label. It's been very interesting, but obviously it's been a big challenge. It's very different trying to do everything alone and figuring everything out little by little. But it's been fun. It's been nice to keep releasing as much music as we can, too.
WM: How would you say the industry views southern rock and blues rock bands today?
EC: I think record labels aren't contributing much when it comes to rock. I think they're filtering out a lot of things right now. We've always been about doing things ourselves, even on a major label. And I think that's why we're surviving without a label now, because we're able to produce records ourselves, manage and release records ourselves. As far as blues rock is concerned, I think it's like every other genre. If you fit a certain mold, then maybe they'll try to do something with you. But really, they're just trying to throw gasoline on the fire and make easy money. I don't think they're really nurturing this kind of music.
RG: I think rock 'n' roll isn't really at the forefront of popularity either, especially in the United States. It seems like the most popular type of music these days is bands that are coming back and doing the same thing as other bands that came back before. Nowadays we see a lot of bands coming back and doing big tours. I think record labels end up chasing what's popular instead of investing in something and making it popular. And I think that, because rock music isn't at the forefront – it's not like R&B, hip-hop, or Taylor Swift – it doesn't end up getting as much attention. But at the same time, [rock] has a more dedicated audience. And nurturing that more dedicated fanbase leads to a more lasting career trajectory than having a moment of stardom or being propelled by an industry, like in pop music.
A lot of things in the industry right now are about analytics and numbers. And on paper, the numbers aren't that good for rock, especially something that isn't very radio-focused. So they just don't pay as much attention because the focus is on statistical numbers, but we're on the road seeing things. We go and play in places all over the world and see the people and how much it means to them. And I think rock 'n' roll fans are much more passionate and much more interested in that in the long term, rather than something like: I like this Dua Lipa song I heard on the radio, so I'm going to the show. We're investing a lot in that side when we're doing what we're doing.
EC: Statistics are good for business, but not for rock 'n' roll. Rock 'n' roll is about feeling.
WM : You've been a band for 20 years, and in this new EP you talk about themes like being overwhelmed with work, searching for purpose, missing home, and working very hard to achieve what you want. I'd like to know if these are personal themes for you as a band.
EC: Yes, absolutely. I think we owe a lot of our success to our hard work, persistence, and refusal to give up. It's a very tough industry and you need luck, a lot of luck, but you also need to enjoy working hard to ensure that you have lucky moments and that, when the chances arise, they become more than just an opportunity to become a success. But we believe in working hard. That's something I think we all learned from our parents, seeing it as a value.
At the same time, I think when you run your own business, like in a band, you always feel a fear of: What if people stop caring and you stop selling tickets and people stop listening to your music? And then there's this feeling that I have to work really hard. I have to work all the time. And it's hard to balance that while living a life where you actually get to do things. Like, what are we working for? We obviously love playing music, but I want to be able to jump in a lake and take a vacation. And sometimes that's not possible. So it's about rectifying those two things, which are the need to work hard, but also the desire to have a more fulfilling life.
RG: I think anyone who says they have everything planned probably doesn't. A good part of these 20 years has been about trying to figure things out and moving forward, and then looking back, seeing how it went, and changing some things. And I think during the pandemic, especially, a lot of people changed their perspective on how they do things, because a large part of the music industry, in particular, is always going full steam ahead. Before you even finish one thing, you're already talking about what the next one will be. And so, taking a break during the pandemic, when we couldn't do shows, we couldn't record, and that kind of thing, it really allowed us to reassess how we do things and gain some perspective. But, you know, it takes a lot of luck, but I think along with a lot of luck there's also a lot of courage that's needed, like not just hard work, but smart hard work. And we've always tried to be smarter about how we do things.
Ewan and I have a lot of conversations. Two days ago we had a long call just to talk about this year and what we hope for next year. For us, it's very important not to underestimate what we have and to know that all of this could probably disappear at some point, and instead to always be figuring out how we can move forward and keep doing this. And so, yeah, a lot of the themes on this record end up reflecting the fact that, you know, this is a job. This isn't just doing shows and drinking beer or whatever. It's a real job. But you know, we really love it and we're very passionate about it. So we put all that energy into it because it's important to us too.
EC: But I also love drinking beer.
WM: Have you guys ever tried caipirinhas? It's a traditional Brazilian drink made with cachaça.
RG: Jen, who works for us, has a partner who is Brazilian, and she spends a month a year in Brazil. They brought me a bottle [of cachaça] last year. It's in my office, but I can't open it because I want my first sip to be in the drink Jen is going to make for me. They'll be very happy that I mentioned this; I'm glad you asked. I haven't had it yet because every time they're in town we're doing a lot of things and we don't have time just to drink.
WM: Do you have plans to come to Brazil?
EC: Yes, we're exploring the possibility. We'd love to go, it's one of our favorite places. None of us have ever been there, but we've developed a certain fondness for it. My brother and I are big fans of Tropicália, music from the 60s and 70s, like Os Mutantes.
WM: There's a Brazilian band that also plays blues rock and 70s rock. They're called Hurricanes. It would be very interesting to hear some kind of collaboration between you two.
RG: We always joke that our real goal is to find rock 'n' roll fans and go play for them. And we've noticed for a while now that some of these passionate and dedicated rock fans are in South America and Brazil.
EC: Our goal is to continue traveling the world and find more places where people love rock 'n' roll. I'll definitely research the Hurricanes, that's great. It seems like a really cool idea to find some friends we can do some shows with. We'll definitely go and we want to go to Brazil.